Wikinvest Wire

Tuesday, August 09, 2011

Market Commentary From Navin R. Johnson

There are a couple of ways you can take this post. One is that I am a jerk (I have family that will agree with you) and the other is to understand how important it is to call BS on what you are hearing and look at things in their simplest light. Put differently, big picture things are often what they appear to be.

For the past few years I have been a broken record on several points and nothing has changed fundamentally in a big picture sense with any of them. That the fundies haven't changed isn't the best way to articulate the point.

The banks first flashed a warning years and years ago by virtue of their weighting in the S&P 500; more that 20% is a flashing yellow light. Then the yield curve inverted which makes lending less profitable which lead to the perceived need by the banks to take more risk for the same return. This dynamic, referred to in some circles as a Minsky Moment, played a large role in the financial crisis.

By financial crisis I mean the worst one in 80 years.

At the same time Europe was having a financial crisis of its own and it too was really bad. If you've been following all along then you've been reading how bad this is, same as many people have and there has been no reason to think things have improved any. Quite the opposite, Europe appears to be much worse.

One argument in favor of buying banks has been that they are attractively priced in relation to their book value. This argument has been made up, down and all around including Barron's a couple times. Um the real estate market is nowhere near getting better so how can the book values be thought of as being correct? This question has been asked by some people but not enough. From the simplest view possible banks lend money for real estate, they have loans outstanding for real estate and the real estate market is still going down (slower than before) so how can book values be correct? You don't need a degree in forensic accounting to come up with this question.

Banks from the US and Europe have offered a couple of good trades along the way, no doubt, but the fundamentals have stunk all the way along and they still stink. I don't know how the pundits miss this but they do. Just stay away.

I've also prattled on about municipal bonds. The states are collectively up a creek even with tax revenues generally higher this year than last. There are deficit and underfunding issues galore which is a new phenomenon on this kind of scale. This makes the risk in the muni bond space different than it has been in the past--on this scale. This is not a Meredith Whitney proclamation of failures just a very obvious recognition that the fundamental dynamics in this space are not normal and this is manifested in intermarket yield spreads that are not normal. Where bonds are concerned I would prefer normal over abnormal.

Now it is possible that the downgrade will in turn have a direct impact on the muni market along the lines of states can't have a better rating than the country.

The above process of looking at things simplistically and going with the obvious conclusion can also apply right now to other European equities besides the banks, Japan and probably a few other things. This is obviously an Occam's Razor argument and while I do not know why some many people had to bet on BAC and Citigroup earlier this year there is no way that the simple viewpoint could leave anyone surprised that the worst crisis in 80 years still has a long way to go for the banks.

Can there be any doubt now that some huge portion of the doubling off the 2009 low was aided by the desperate measures taken by the Fed, Treasury and the Administration? The take away is to be skeptical anytime someone makes an extreme justification about why some apparently broken segment of the market is in fact not broken. Think about the parade of people who never saw the crisis coming (based on their public comments anyway). Now the downgrade doesn't matter. Really?

11 comments:

Anonymous said...

Relief is coming. My eco indicator has been turningh up for a week. The bottoming process should take place to aug.22 and the upswing should be to oct 7. A slow downward move then should start with a climax from oct 22 to oct 31.
Jeff from Milan, Italy

Anonymous said...

It's kind of pathetic whenever someone who missed a correction completely now says that stocks are "oversold". Really? Roger, you alluded to this in a recent post, whenever (insert name of real smart person) says to buy this or that, take it with a grain of salt. Do your own thinking, I believe that is what you have been advocating and I strongly agree...

Mark from L-Ville

Roger Nusbaum said...

yes Mark, it'd be nice for more people to apply more of a filter to what they hear

Anonymous said...

Mark from L-ville,
if you are talking about me the should read june 20th post(http://randomroger.blogspot.com/2011/06/end-of-world-as-not-foretold-by-wall.html). There are post after (21) and even before
. While lots of people wrote that a new high was coming I was warning that a correction was emminent and in place because the internals was were weeking(not the A/D). To make a statement like you have when I have been one the few is unfit and misgided. Perhaps I should keep my comments to my self instead of sharing. Something that I have been thinking about strongly. Mark, I have do not know what kind of contributor you have been, but many times I have shared market turning points within this blog, and have been pretty accurate.
Jeff from Milan, Italy

Paul said...

Funny, I have family members who think I am a jerk (actually they use stronger wording) too.

I recently read Mark Cuban's blog titled "What Business is Wall Street in?" that has a strong corollary to your post today. It is worth the the google time time to find the post.

Interesting times indeed...

Anonymous said...

good comments Roger.

Jeff, don't get so defensive, I think we all enjoy your comments.

Anonymous said...

Jeff, do not worry about a few critics many of us like your comments.

Roger, please remind people predictions are difficult to make, especially about the future.

everyone, these things happen from time to time and most people do not see them coming and if they do see them coming they are not sure of the magnitude.

We are very over sold, but lets see what the fed says.

Anonymous said...

Jeff,

I agree we are in a bottoming process, but how did you get a date of aug 22? I was hoping by next week, but we really are not that different.

Any projections for the upswing top for the S&P? I have none at this time.

Anonymous said...

Roger,

You wrote,
"Um the real estate market is nowhere near getting better so how can the book values be thought of as being correct? This question has been asked by some people but not enough. From the simplest view possible banks lend money for real estate, they have loans outstanding for real estate and the real estate market is still going down (slower than before) so how can book values be correct? You don't need a degree in forensic accounting to come up with this question. "

As a long time reader, I know you like to make things as simple as possible so as to not obscure the big picture. But I think sometimes you go too far with that philosophy. For example, in the case of banks and how their book values are defined, there is a concept of reserves for bad debt. So the book value is wrong only if future losses are greater than what's already *expected* and built in to the balance sheet. I think it's reasonable to assume that a further decline in housing prices is already expected, so what makes you think the banks' book values are inflated?

This is just one example, but a more general thing you may want to think about is *over* simplification. There's a great saying from Einstein: "Things should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler".

- aagold

Anonymous said...

I am vacationing in the italian riviera with family and only have my portable. I am not using any of the programs that normaly use but very few simplistic excel sheets.
I have a calculation that times the magnitude of a decline. After such decline it usualy takes about 10 trading days for the market to bottom before the next upwing. That is from 1 day to 10 days. So a week is ok too. It can be in a form of a double bottom or an upswing and then a downturn to then make a more sustanable upswing. The upswing should be to oct 7 then an initial decline and a down climax on a date from oct 22 to oct 31.
Thanks for your positive comments.
I have only done my best, hopefully can do the same for my operation.
Best,
Jeff from Milan, Italy

Roger Nusbaum said...

aagold your comment implies more faith in the banks' process for setting aside and then pulling forward loan loss reserves than I have. it seems too arbitrary.

Proud Member Of